All the differences between Starace (Enel), Descalzi (Eni) and Alverà (Snam) on hydrogen and its surroundings
What the company heads of Enel, Eni and Snam said during the recent talk organized by Il Sole 24 Ore “The strategy on hydrogen and the energy transition”.
Symptoms or differences on hydrogen for the major Italian players? The question is a must after the latest confrontation that emerged in the recent talk organized by Il Sole 24 Ore “The strategy on hydrogen and the energy transition”. If until a few days before it was possible to see many points of contact on the subject of hydrogen, it is enough to recall the speeches at the RCS Academy event, the director of Enel Francesco Starace, that of Eni Claudio Descalzi and the head of the company of Snam Marco Alverà recorded friction points in view of the NRP, the Pniec and all the other instruments that Italy, in agreement with Brussels, is developing to achieve the climate and energy targets set for 2030 and 2050.
STARACE (ENEL) POINTS ITS FINGER AGAINST CCS, ELECTROLYZERS AND HYDROGEN TRANSPORT
Starace has pointed the finger at the capture of CO2, electrolysers and the transport of hydrogen which are, in fact, the leading sectors of Eni and Snam. Hydrogen, Enel's number one explained, “is a very small molecule, it permeates and passes through metals. It has an incredible ability to sneak between metals and is consumed where it is produced because it is difficult to transport, so it must be compressed a lot. Creating gas enriched with hydrogen is another matter but it is not the solution to the energy transition ”, explained Starace. Blending is "a way to transport hydrogen molecules which will eventually be burned with gas and therefore do not solve the problem of decarbonising the economy". Furthermore, in the opinion of the Enel manager, the best applications for the vector are those in heavy industry, such as steel and cement, while “it would be nonsense to produce electricity with hydrogen like using it for heating”.
As for the Co2 sequestration and capture tools, Starace said that this technology presents "numerous problems and difficulties" and cited the Gorgon field in Australia. In addition, he added, "from a cost point of view, it is certainly not cheap for all industries that produce CO2: if it worked, we could have used it in power plants, but nobody does". Without forgetting, he then recalled, the problem of protests that could come from populations close to a CO2 field. “I believe that the costs of electrolysers will be reduced sooner than those of the CCS”. Electrolysers which, Starace said, "are now a luxury item for niche applications" such as the early days of solar panels.
FROM DESCALZI (ENI) NO COMPETITION BETWEEN BLUE AND GREEN HYDROGEN BUT FULL SUPPORT TO CCS
Eni's CEO, Claudio Descalzi, who avoided puttingblue and green hydrogen incompetition : "In an industry where energy is needed and decarbonization, if you look for opposition, the process slows down, you have to be neutral and work according to the purposes. I do not foresee that we will create blue hydrogen to go on mobility or to see it to third parties we have to do it because we are the first producers and consumers and we have to meet our needs. Our goal is to remove CO2 by capturing it, therefore it is a solution to decarbonise our plants ”, admitted Descalzi. "But at some point, I believe, there will only be green hydrogen which now has very high costs" with the need to make investments "for not too high periods", explained the Eni manager who, however, did not hide doubts about mobility. hydrogen: “Investments are also made on the basis of demand, and today there are not many hydrogen transports. I think there will be growth in the future, starting with heavy transport ”. Not only. “We have equipped ourselves and we will begin to have multifunctional service stations but I think that in the future as success with the electric there will be growth – continued Descalzi -. Hydrogen gives many advantages because the car can be filled up in a few minutes and can also be useful on railways ".
Regarding CO2 capture, "we have been selected by the UK in Liverpool Bay to decarbonise their heavy industry and are encouraged around the world because it is the most effective method for decarbonising energy systems, ammonia, paper mills". While from a regulatory point of view Descalzi concluded that "probably on hydrogen and biofuels there will be a need for a regulated system to achieve the objectives: we have been saying for 20 years that we have to make coal disappear but it is still there we have to deal with reality and create a context to reach the targets ".
ALVERA '(SNAM) BETS ON THE TRANSPORT OF HYDROGEN
The position of Snam's CEO, Marco Alverà, is clear on hydrogen and in particular on transport. For Alverà, “all technologies are needed” to produce energy. “According to Irena, electricity will cover 50% of world needs compared to 20% today: the remainder and all consumption that cannot be electrified or that it makes no sense to electrify must use molecules such as hydrogen and biofuels. In short, there is a lot of space for everyone. The resources are huge and you need to be agile. If we think about how much money has been spent to bring down the costs of solar panels this has made the transition an opportunity rather than a cost. We need to focus on technologies that work or make industrial choices different from other countries: our North Star must be Europe and within it Germany which has an economic fabric similar to ours. What is important is not to make infrastructural choices that can then be wrong ”, said the head of the Snam company. “The beauty of hydrogen is its versatility and the possibility that it can be transported. The steel we used after 1986 for our pipelines is already certified to be able to transport up to 100% hydrogen and we have already transported it even mixed with gas. Blending can be a tactical way to create hydrogen demand without changing anything and not investing in infrastructure ”.
Alverà recalled that “only for electrical needs we need 10GW of renewables in Italy and we have 1. We must remember that in Germany they no longer want wind turbines and last week, for example, photovoltaics did not work for snow. Once again the North Star must be Europe and Germany which is telling us that we must go and use hydrogen and in their case take it from outside: Nord Stream for example, it is not said, but it can also be used for this. We must consider that transport by tube costs 10 times less than transport by ship and that we in Italy have an important geographical advantage also due to the proximity to Algeria, Tunisia and Libya ”where we can“ build giga factories and then import green hydrogen. Certainly where there is low-cost gas such as in Russia or the Emirates, the blue hydrogen will always cost less than the green one. For the competitiveness of industry, the Germans have a color-blind approach then they will use public money to create a green supply chain at an internal level ”.
This is a machine translation from Italian language of a post published on Start Magazine at the URL https://www.startmag.it/energia/tutte-le-divergenze-tra-starace-descalzi-e-alvera-su-idrogeno-e-co2/ on Mon, 05 Apr 2021 07:00:39 +0000.